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Post by ιady ταвz on Nov 21, 2006 16:43:15 GMT -5
Thats interesting misshoneychurch we are always being told we have the highest teen pregnancy rate too...maybe it's the governments way to get teens to keep ther pants on...lol. Most Brits think Bush (shrub..I love that) is an arse. I am embaressed that our esteamed 'leader' feels the need to follow him like a lapdog in every decision he makes. (not that I would vote conservative either) go Brits!! i knew i always liked them...you PM should do his own thing or the UK will be involved in this pointless conflict the US has. As for the US, i want Hillary Clinton to win the elections in 2008, when i graduate from High skool...she hopefully will as Democrats are in power now..wooo |
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Post by misshoneychurch88 on Nov 21, 2006 16:55:57 GMT -5
I want Hillary Clinton to go away. On her own, as a Senator I think she's ok, a little too hawkish for my tastes, but generally ok, but if she goes for the Presidency she will most likely screw the Dems on a massive scale. I think she's just too dividing to win a national election. I'd love Edwards to go again. He's got good policies and god forbid he actually has charisma. Obama has a chance too, but I'm not sure if he's ready for it yet, he may not have eough experience to win...oooh I can't wait for this  |
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Post by ιady ταвz on Nov 21, 2006 17:12:17 GMT -5
nah..she has a pretty good chance..she'll do well in my eyes
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Post by misshoneychurch88 on Nov 21, 2006 17:27:08 GMT -5
yeah, but there are alot of people who absolutly hate her, for no real reason. I would vote for her, but I don't think she would get a majority, especially if the Republicans run a moderate. I want a woman president, but I don't think she's the one who'll do it.
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Post by childminerva on Nov 21, 2006 17:53:02 GMT -5
I really don't think the Rebublicans have a chance for 08. Rudy G. (can't spell his last name...but you all know who I mean) is their strongest candidate so far and yet he has so many scandals of his own that the consevative christians (all the rebublican party has left now) won't support him. Hillary would be amazing, though I doubt the Dems would unite to support her. Edwards would be ideal (hmmm Hillary and Edwards...) but we shall see.
This is the beauty of being legal...you can seriously consider these things, then vote! The sad thing is, when the Dems take over the white house in '08, I still won't be allowed to celebrate with alcohol!
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Post by EloquentPhoenix on Nov 21, 2006 17:55:03 GMT -5
How did we get onto politics I wonder...?
I'm sad that Blair isn't going to be the labour leader (UK here) anymore, I do like him. I know a lot of people don't particularly for the war but he is a good leader and he's done our country good. I really don't like Gordon Brown though, as if we could end up with him. Rather him than David 'Stuck up tory but I'll pretend I understand normal people hug a hoodie' cambell. And I don't count the lib dems because they're just weak with no real opinions apart from that we shoudl withdraw our troops from Iraq. Yeah, great idea, let it decend into more chaos since the Iraqi police still need our help. We put ourselves in there, we need to see it through.
/rant.
And this is only because I don't know anything about American politics apart from that Bush is an idiot. I'll be able to vote in our next elections, provided it isn't in 2007 which it won't be. I got to go on the electoral register list when it came to our house this year. I was so excited. That's why I dont understand people who don't vote or care about politics. It affects too much not to care.
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Post by jayejaye on Nov 21, 2006 18:04:47 GMT -5
No still no sign. All he will say is he will be gone before the next election. (sooner the better for me..sorry eloquantphoenix.. ) My family has a long Labour history and for me Tony is just not Labour. Bring back the old socialists I say.Oh and I HATE David Cameron too..(hug a hoodie.."what a lot of old shit" ..to quote the gran in Catherine Tate). Trouble is, in my opinion, there is no credible political party capable of running our country well at the moment. Which worryingly leaves the way clear for nutters like UKIP and the BNP to gain support.
I don't really understand the American political system. What is the difference between the Republicans and Democrats???
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Post by ιady ταвz on Nov 21, 2006 18:09:36 GMT -5
Repbulicans are conservative and strict, Democrats are liberal and flexible
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Post by jayejaye on Nov 21, 2006 18:17:26 GMT -5
thanks Lady_TabZ...
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Post by childminerva on Nov 21, 2006 18:18:31 GMT -5
Democrats are generally pro-choice when it comes to abortion, support gay rights and other social issues. Republicans are generally fundamentalist christians; not that that's a bad thing...but ugh.
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Post by ιady ταвz on Nov 21, 2006 18:21:07 GMT -5
no problem
im a democrat-republican i guess, im for decision making and free will and stuff but i also do believe that some things are wrong...confusing but that's me for ya
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Post by childminerva on Nov 21, 2006 18:44:18 GMT -5
I don't mind Republicans in general-one of my best friends is a fundamentalist christian from Texas, lol, but I get so frustrated with people who will go along with anything said by our president because to go against the republicans is to go against "religion". I myself am a christian and I hate it when religion is used as a political tool.
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Post by jayejaye on Nov 21, 2006 18:50:52 GMT -5
I see..... Religion is something that hasn't really been a factor in British politics for some time.. Racism yes,(thinks of Oswald Mosley in the 1940's and the BNP now) but not religion. Of course world events in recent years have meant it is becoming an issue again.(personally I think this will only lead to trouble)
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Post by childminerva on Nov 21, 2006 18:56:56 GMT -5
Racism isn't so bad...sexism is getting better now that we have a female speaker of the house! She is next in line for presidency after Shrub and Dickhead Cheney. Religion is a huge political factor here, always has been.
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Post by angeldust on Nov 21, 2006 19:21:26 GMT -5
Oh dear politics  . Blair is supposedly stepping down in march or may next year to be replaced by Gordon Brown *who looks like a monkey I don't think much of him at all heres hopeing he's better then Mr. idiout Blair.* Though I would never vote conservative but I am very sure that labour is slowly bank rupting the NHS I can see it eventually it will all end up private first it will start everyone who earns over a certain amount has to go private and it will continue until it's all gone and they have to say 'oh look the nhs isn't working we have to pull the plug' because even idiout mr. blair is not foolish enough to just stop the nhs there would be up roar. I actually find in England at the moment racisum has swapped there has been so much adjusting to those coming into the country it's the british getting the prejudice! Seriously down a street close to mine in a apprantly 'multi cultural' society there are divali flags and lights yet you never see any for christmas. Never. |
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Post by childminerva on Nov 21, 2006 19:41:32 GMT -5
hehe...bush looks like a monkey too.
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Post by ιady ταвz on Nov 21, 2006 20:08:05 GMT -5
I don't mind Republicans in general-one of my best friends is a fundamentalist christian from Texas, lol, but I get so frustrated with people who will go along with anything said by our president because to go against the republicans is to go against "religion". I myself am a christian and I hate it when religion is used as a political tool. u ahte it too...going against re[ublicans is not against religion..im christian but im more liberal and yes bush does look like a monkey |
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Post by jayejaye on Nov 21, 2006 20:16:21 GMT -5
lol angeldust... he does look like a monkey. I don't think much of him either (But anyone has to be better than old 2 jags Prescott..he can't even form a coherant sentence *hmm rather like Bush*) I also agree with you about the NHS. I am a nurse and things have got steadily worse for both patients and staff under Blair.
I take your point about prejudice against the British. (That woman working for BA not being allowed to wear her cross is a case in point) But I think a large part of it is misguided attempts by the powers that be to avoid being seen as racist. (like schools where they can celebrate Divali and Hannuka (sp) but not Christmas).
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Post by ιady ταвz on Nov 21, 2006 20:25:08 GMT -5
HMMM...diwali is cool...my family is hindu...but not being allowed to celebrate christmas?? why?
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Post by jayejaye on Nov 21, 2006 21:01:45 GMT -5
OH god..moving from politics to religion..the 2 things you should never discuss in polite company (as my nan used to say). OK here goes...At the moment the british establishment seems to be more concerned with showing they are not just tolerant of but support the religious practices of other cultures. In doing this they seem to be actively ignoring and trivialising christianity (I have no religion btw..). For example the christmas postage stamps have just been released. But they don't show any religious imagary. Where I work we have been told not to send christmas cards but seasonal greetings...thats just mad..IT'S CHRISTMAS... But during Eid we weren't told we couldn't send cards. It's this double standard that is causing ill feeling between the different cultures in Britain at the moment and I can see it just getting worse. Personally I believe that we should all be able to express our religious beliefs equally and publicly. But I think It's a little naive to expect that to happen here at the moment. Sorry if i'm boring everybody. Shutting up now.
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Post by ιady ταвz on Nov 21, 2006 21:31:24 GMT -5
that's so wrong!!! its hypocrisy!! accept one religion but ignore the dominant one? If im correct Anglicans are the majority of the UK?
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Post by EloquentPhoenix on Nov 22, 2006 2:50:51 GMT -5
Well. They are and they aren't. I'm sceptical to the amount of actual Chrisitans we have left. And by that I mean the genuine ones. I have a lot of problems with the way that the mulit-cultural society we're supposed to have isn't working for a lot of white British people. There's an awful lot of racial tension in our country right now. I'd say particularly in the north (Jack Straw, Blackburn anyone? I support what he said. I'm like that, I think that it needed saying.). To the point.
Oh so that's the difference between democrats and rebublicans. So democrats then.
Speaking of the BNP. I hate them, and their policies, but if they got a single seat it might show how unhapy we all are, which is increasingly necessary.
Why do you all hate Blair? And I don't think he's draining the NHS, there are too many people and we're a much too populated country and also an aging one. I don't expect a perfect country with no problems, because it'll never be like that, I believe that labour deal with our country's problems better than the conservatives ever could. And I just don't count the Lib Dems. Sorry. But ergh Brown/Prescott. I say John Reid! Sorry. And I do think Tony Blair is labour. Old labour back though?
jayejaye: I agree with your nan. And I'd point out that I have been very restrained, so if I still offended anyone which I don't think that I could have. Sorry. It oculd have been worse.
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Post by jayejaye on Nov 22, 2006 4:32:47 GMT -5
Eloquentphoenix I don't think you have said anything offensive..
My problem with Blair is that (rightly or wrongly) I see him as weak particularly over immigration and in his foreign policy ..and I was against the second Iraq war from the start.. I believe it was much more about oil than Saddam.
I thought the BNP had already got one or two seats in the last election (in East London and somewhere up north) but I could be wrong.
As for the NHS maybe you're right... Perhaps a service designed in the 1950's just isn't appropriate for the very different population dynamic now. Either way I agree the NHS is screwed (and yes old labour i'm afraid..I am a socialist at heart)
hmmm if I was in the USA i think I would definatly support the Democrats.
Sorry if I have offended anybody too..but I reread my posts and I don't think I have.
Anyway how did we get from misshoneychurch's birthday to this???
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Post by osusprinks on Nov 22, 2006 12:25:47 GMT -5
I have no idea how this happened, but I feel to blame for some reason. Just a few points...
~Thank you guys for the discussion of British politics! I don't know much about it and it was interesting to hear all your opinions! What is the BNP?
I worry sometimes that Tony Blair has been hurt by his involvement with Iraq. I know that Bush has as well, but I care more about Blair, lol. It seemed like (remember this is the impression from across the pond, I don't know what it was really) he was well liked and was doing good things before the war. I hope this didn't drag him and his party down.
~When you get to basics, American Democrats are for big government. They believe that there should be regulations and laws to protect Americans and our interests and that the Government should be in charge of all that. Dems want the government to take responsibility for our people and to help them through legislation, etc. American Republicans (GOP) are for small government. They want the government to be less involved in our everyday lives and only step in for major problems. They also put more faith in federalism (the division of power between the national gov't and the state gov'ts.) They think things would be better if the government were less involved and things were left to work out on their own to an extent.
While it is true that Democrats tend to be more liberal on social issues than the GOP, I have met many gay Republicans, and many pro-life Democrats. My best friend is an ardent Republican and I am a true blue Dem, but we actually agree on a lot of issues. What we don't agree on is how they should be accomplished. Example: Ann is pro-choice, but she thinks each state should be able to decide for itself. I'm pro-choice, but I think we need national laws to protect every woman's right to choose, not just those who live in an area they are the majority.
Does that make sense?
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Post by EloquentPhoenix on Nov 22, 2006 16:35:07 GMT -5
BNP stands for the British National Party. yeah it does make sense now |
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Post by jayejaye on Nov 22, 2006 17:26:46 GMT -5
That makes a lot of sense osusprinks. It's not as black and white as I thought . I think overall I would probably still support the democrats. Do you have any other parties or independant candidates at all? We have several others but labour/conservative are the main two.
The BNP (british national party) has one main policy..the..er 'voluntary' repatriation of all 'non british nationals' ..basically they are a racist group but with a veil of political respectability (funny though I don't know of any other policies they have). The racial tension Eloquentphoenix described has led to them gaining more support in areas where it is particularly bad.
I think that the Iraq war and the whole 'war on terrorism' has probably been Blair's downfall. A lot of my friends who supported him have changed their minds because of this. One of my friends (a staunch conservative) actually blames the 7/7 bombings directly on his support of Shrub's war on terror (I am going to call him shrub all the time now..lol). While I think there were a lot of other factors there are many who agree with her.
I have been thinking more about Eloquentphoenix's comments about the NHS and I think she may have a point. I'm not sure any party could have resurected it . When it was started Britain had a much younger (and smaller) population after so many adults were killed in the war. Perhaps some radical changes are needed if it is to survive.
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Post by ιady ταвz on Nov 22, 2006 19:37:25 GMT -5
talk about getting off topic lol
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Post by childminerva on Nov 22, 2006 20:10:16 GMT -5
I dunno...18 is the age whn you can vote here, so this stuff if important. Still, happy birthday misshoneychurch88 once again!!!
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Post by ιady ταвz on Nov 22, 2006 20:28:34 GMT -5
yea...but like i said, i cant vote when im 18
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Post by childminerva on Nov 22, 2006 20:41:25 GMT -5
when can you vote? (I guess I missed the post where you said this before...)
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x
. Blair is supposedly stepping down in march or may next year to be replaced by Gordon Brown *who looks like a monkey I don't think much of him at all heres hopeing he's better then Mr. idiout Blair.* Though I would never vote conservative but I am very sure that labour is slowly bank rupting the NHS I can see it eventually it will all end up private first it will start everyone who earns over a certain amount has to go private and it will continue until it's all gone and they have to say 'oh look the nhs isn't working we have to pull the plug' because even idiout mr. blair is not foolish enough to just stop the nhs there would be up roar. 
