Children

[Jessabelle]

I just want to know what most people think about the possibility of them having children!

[ismaco]

I don't think so... I believe they have enough with Hogwarts... but, mmm I don't know why I imagine them better as grandparents (though, obviously they cannot be grandparents without any kids so... who knows)
Isabel

[prodigyviolin101]

It doesn't seem logical, atleast to me, that they would. They know how many enemies they have made, and i don't think they have the heart to put anyone else through that (especially Albus)

[zoeteproet]

I'm not sure if they have children. If they have, then they have probaly a lot of children.
But there is also the possibility that they didn't want to risk children, with all there enemies.

[mcgonagallrocks]

I said no because of the whole enemies thing, but I'm sure Min and Albus wants kids.

[minnies daughter]

I imagine them having kids. I my stories (though I haven't posted any of the i-net) they have kids. I think they would make excellent 'rents.

[ravenhaired]

I don't know...I would be more of the opinion Minervan and Albus would consider having children selfish, as they'd be potential targets for Death Eaters.

[beMMADfabulous]

ravenhaired said:

I don't know...I would be more of the opinion Minervan and Albus would consider having children selfish, as they'd be potential targets for Death Eaters.

I'm not too sure, and I agree with this.

[beMMADfabulous]

Hmm, again nerva, you have a point. I'm not leaning either way on this topic because anything's possible. In fact, it's just as possible for them to have kids as it is for them not to have them. I guess it really comes down to JK and our own little MMAD world if we choose to believe otherwise.

[beMMADfabulous]

"Fabi"... *ponders* Yay, I like that name! hehe

[Admiral Sun Wentai]

Maybe they had... twins, triplets, quads, quins, sextuplets, seps...
or more...

[ravenhaired]

Guys, probably I am too idealistic or romantic, but if they let themselves to be ruled by this - by fears, to give up the real meaning of life - how could they possibly consider themselves Gryffindor. And how could anybody consider Albus' being a great wizard if he had not been able to protect his own family. (BTW why the bloody hell did he offered Draco and his mother to be protected in HBP, if he was not sure he could manage...)
I don't want anybody to convince... But sometimes I really wonder why you think about Dumbledore how you think...

You bring up good points, but I think Dumbledore considers his first duty to his cause (the downfall of Voldemort) and not children. The death of a child could be a blow Dumbledore wouldn't get over and Dumbledore wasn't personally offering to take care of Draco and his mother, but have them protected by the Order.

Dumbledore is a man who'd sacrifice his own personal happiness for the sake of others.

I'm sorry if that sounded rude...

[ravenhaired]

I apologize if I were rude in any way, but this is a topic I am very sensitive of.

Evidently so. Nothing better than a good debate though, is there?

Oh, yes. How well the order protected Harry from the Dementors - see OotP for further details.
Do you honestly think that the Order is capable without Dumbledore? I think the order and Dumbledore are more or less the same.

But if Dumbledore is the order, then shouldn't he have seen to it that the incident in OotP was prevented? Even Dumbledore can make mistakes - like allowing Mundungus to take over the watch.

He's certainly the Head of the order, but I'm not sure the order would be completely helpless without him. I don't think Dumbledore would have let himself be so completely in control that when he was gone, people would be completely lost. I just can't see Dumbledore being that selfish or ridiculous.

BTW. Dumbledore's first duty is not the downfall of Voldemort, but to protect Hogwarts - the children, to prepare Harry (I am not entirely sure, what he would do. Honestly, who believes that a seventeen years old wizard could defeat the Dark Lord? No, there is so much more in the background we are not aware of.) If his aim were to defeat Voldemort he would have been accepted the position of Minister of Magic.

That I'll give you. I had forgot about that.

But I do believe that he considers his first duty to his cause - whatever cause that may be, whether it was protecting Harry or the downfall of Voldemort or even to protecting Hogwarts. He has devoted his entire life to his cause and I do honestly think that he would consider his children at risk - too much risk. His children would be a target for Death Eaters, kidnap, murder, torture.

Whats it worth to have children if the risks to them are simply enormous, so enormous you couldn't give them a normal, happy childhood, but simply protection all the time so they never can live like normal children?

And tell me, what kind of personal happiness are you talking about?
I could only repeat myself, to give up the meaning of the life would mean he is ot better than Voldemort. To give love you need to know how to accept it.

I just can't imagine him sitting in an armchair by the fireplace and contemplating the turmoil of the world happening around him - lonely, without someone offering him condolences. Take this as a perfect picture of the projection of sacrificing his own happiness.

Possibly, he had children far more before Grindelwald or Voldemort - I certainly hope JK did not want to create a character similar to the Pope.

I don't think a parallel can be drawn between Dumbledore and the Pope. The Pope is a spiritual leader and I can't honestly see any connection between the two apart from them both being rather old men.

I'm talking about the type of happiness that you mean. Children, family. Sometimes these things must be sacrificed in order to do great things and sometimes family can be at risk. Do you think Dumbledore could stand the thought of a loved one at risk?

I'm not saying that I agree with his possible decision not to have children...I'm just saying that sometimes great men or women can turn themselves into martyrs for their cause, justifying it to themselves by saying that their family would be at risk, their loved ones murdered and tortured. Much like Harry, when he told Ginny he couldn't be with her. She was too much at risk, in too much danger and they could use her to get to Harry. Same thing applies to Dumbledore.

Dumbledore wouldn't have children for 'some stupid noble reason'.

Maybe before Grindelwald? I'm not sure.

Anyway. I've let my thoughts run away with me. Again apologies if this seems rude.

[beMMADfabulous]

nerva said:

I really don't like thinking about him like he would deny happiness from himself.

*clears throat* Sorry to interupt (and a little off topic), but that's all the more reason I'd love for JK to announce in the 7th book that Albus and Minerva were/are (verb tense depending, of course on whether Albus is truly dead) married and maybe even have kids. *waves MMAD flag* ;D

With this happening, she would show us that he, in fact, is not denying all happiness for himself.

[ravenhaired]

p.s.:I don't think that this was the aim of the poll, but I am surely very much enjoying the debate.

Yup! Arguing (as long as we don't start calling each other names ) is fun.

I am afraid, they are similar in the way of their isolation. Moreover, the Pope is not just a spiritual leader - he is the head of the state of Vatican, he has real authority.

But who really would think of him as anything other than a spiritual leader - again, the Pope's main duty is to his faith and being the leader of the Roman Catholic Church throughout the world.

Certainly, that is very much possible. But we don't know anything about Dumbledore. We can't see into his mind.

True. This argument isn't so much about what Dumbledore is, but how we perceive his character.

;D So either could be true, methinks.

Roll on book 7 to end the debate.

[ravenhaired]

It does not matter what we think of the Pope, it does matter what his immediate surrounding think of him. I believe that the strict hierarchical system of Catholic Church makes him very isolated. He has his advisors, council of cardinals - but in a sense he is alone.

Very true. The Pope is essentially alone...I suppose (according to my theory) he's very much in the same boat as Albus in that sense.

While everyone looks to the Pope for help in their faith, everyone looks to Albus for help with...well, everything. Both are considered almost infallible.

God. Even I'm starting to feel sorry for my version of Albus. I might jump ship.

But in a way every president has its equal in the world, but the Pope has not - and in this way, as Headmaster of Hogwarts, Dumbledore lacks of equals. (I don't count e.g. Madame Maxim, I don't think that other wizzarding schools would be so important as Hogwarts.)

I don't think its as Headmaster of Hogwarts makes Albus without equals. Its more that he's made himself without equals.

I mean I'm sure not all Headmasters/mistresses of Hogwarts would have been feared by Voldemort and have the Minister of Magic writing to them, asking for help?

Albus is one of those uncommonly wise people.

Or something. I hope that made sense.

[Leaves of Green]

I'm not sure if they do or not.

[mmadlyinlove]

I think they definitely have children. How many? I am not so sure about that, but I figure at least two or three of them.... And at least one boy. Maybe two girls and a boy. I think, anyway. ~mmadlyinlove~

[tabbyphoenix]

I said yes because I always imagine it that way though admittedly, it's not very logical.

[harmonydumbledore]

I totally think they have kids. Just because their lives are dangerous does not mean they stop enjoying life...and part of that is the love of children.

Didn't McGonagall tell Remus to take a chance because Dumbledore would have loved the idea of more happiness?
Just because he had a dark past I do not think he would close himself off.


Sail on with the kids ADMM!!!!

[mercifulheavens]

Of course they have children! Albus and Minerva were very careful of course, so it is even a bigger secret than their marriage. JK is so very blind (cowers in hopes that she will not be killed for saying that)
They have a son named Horatio Charles McGonagall Dumbledore... read Mothering Secretly!!!

[phantomgirl]

Jan 16, 2009 9:29:09 GMT -5 mercifulheavens said:

Of course they have children! Albus and Minerva were very careful of course, so it is even a bigger secret than their marriage. JK is so very blind (cowers in hopes that she will not be killed for saying that)
They have a son named Horatio Charles McGonagall Dumbledore... read Mothering Secretly!!!

I totally agree with this. That fic is awesome! In other fics I have read on FF.net she and albus had children. there was one where she had 10 or more kids.

[kissofdeath]

Of course! It just hasn't worked out that well.

Read "Because of Them"!

[Katheryn Mae]

Same as kissofdeath - it just doesn't work too well with Hogwarts, their busy lives and their enemies. But usually I see them having a few girls -- I just can't write kid boys that's why they don't have any. xD

[McGonagallsGirl]

mmm, I dunno, I just don't think so. It's not that I'm opposed to the idea, it's just more of a stretch for me than "They were madly in love". Madly in love I can get from the books. Children I can't really find in the books.

--MG

[mcgonagallmmadness]

I think they defininitely have children! I wouldn't personally say Minerva is the original Octo-Mom but... maybe one or two. ;D

[MinervaMcGonagall]

It depends on the story. In my current one, she has a daughter (MG) with her first husband (she was widowed soon after though), and thirty years later, she is raising Trelawney's twin daughters. Plus, her and Albus have a daughter together.

I can always imagine them as parents to daughters though.

[kissofdeath]

Yeah, I noticed that alot of stories tend to have them with daughters in favor of sons. Not that I'm complaining since I am guilty of this myself, but I find it interesting.

[Katheryn Mae]

Same. I haven't written one ADMM story where they have sons. I can't write boys as children very well. Besides ... I just like them with twin daughters as opposed to sons.

[kissofdeath]

I think its because fangirls like to imagine themselves as ADMM's daughters. ^_^