1st scene in PS

[beatabeatrix]

Maybe this has been discussed before, I apologise if it has.
ADMM shipper though I am, their first scene in PS and the only one in which they are alone in all the books, I think, is a problem for me. One would expect them to act in a different way. They don't even seem to be close friends. What are your opinions? Tell me I am wrong

[kissofdeath]

They were probably just being cautious. They weren't really completely sure Voldemort was gone and deatheaters were all over. Plus it was very stressfull for them given the situation. It's not like they could have just started snogging in the middle of the street.

[prodigyviolin101]

I too believe that they were airing on the side of caution...it would not be safe for them to express their affection openly

[beatabeatrix]

Ok, I've never meant snogging. It just seemed to me he didn't trust her enough to tell her about his plans, that's all.

[MinervaMcGonagall]

Maybe they weren't lovers yet.

[kissofdeath]

There are millions of cats that look like McGonagall's tabby form. They were in a muggle part of London at that time. There wouldnt really be a reason for Dumbledore to assume that that particular cat was McGonagall. She also probably didn't want him to know she was there and was surprised that he recognized her so easily.

Does that make any sense?

[mmadlyinlove]

My assumption about the whole him knowing it was her is that he knows her so well he can set her "tabby" form apart from any other so called and real "tabby" cat... That's my opinion anyway. Also, she has those markings around her eyes where her glasses should be.

And I also believe what people before me have said. They were being cautious because what if Voldemort's followers were around? At least, that's what I think.

~mmadlyinlove~

[Alesia]

This is actually really funny we are talking about as I JUST reread that chapter like 5 hours ago (I started my reread for DH today). Anyway I always read Albus's remark back to her as a bit flippant like 'duh Minerva we have known each other for 35 years (lovers or not) and you show all of your 3rd years your form of course I know it was you'.

Knowing what we know now you see that he is also a bit cocky in this scene. Albus knows that Voldemort is gone, that he has acted in accordance with the prophecy and marked Harry as his equal, so Albus knows that eventually he has THE weapon needed to use against Voldemort AND that they have a little bit of a break since Voldemort has been 'killed'. To some extant the banter between them is reminiscent of friends who are fighting with each other. Or at least that is my opinion.

I also hold out hope because of JKR’s comments about the married professors.

Have any of the Hogwarts professors had spouses?
JKR: Good question - yes, a few of them, but that information is sort of restricted - you'll find out why..”

www.accio-quote.org/articles/2001/0301-bbc-rednose.htm


What other Professor would it matter except maybe Snape, but she doesn’t seem to like him very much.

[tabbycat]

I agree. It's not very telling that she asked "how did you know that it was me" -- it was more telling that Albus knew it was her without much effort. I never really looked at it like that before!

It's a tricky scene, that one.

I also tend to believe that JKR didn't really have concrete plans about their relationship when she was beginning the series.

frustrating, isn't it?! I'm going crazy for any sort of explanation. If this isnt answered in book 7 I think I might actually cry. In front of people. For months.

[tabbycat]

alesia said:

This is actually really funny we are talking about as I JUST reread that chapter like 5 hours ago (I started my reread for DH today). Anyway I always read Albus's remark back to her as a bit flippant like 'duh Minerva we have known each other for 35 years (lovers or not) and you show all of your 3rd years your form of course I know it was you'.

Knowing what we know now you see that he is also a bit cocky in this scene. Albus knows that Voldemort is gone, that he has acted in accordance with the prophecy and marked Harry as his equal, so Albus knows that eventually he has THE weapon needed to use against Voldemort AND that they have a little bit of a break since Voldemort has been 'killed'. To some extant the banter between them is reminiscent of friends who are fighting with each other. Or at least that is my opinion.

I also hold out hope because of JKR’s comments about the married professors.

Have any of the Hogwarts professors had spouses?
JKR: Good question - yes, a few of them, but that information is sort of restricted - you'll find out why..”

www.accio-quote.org/articles/2001/0301-bbc-rednose.htm


What other Professor would it matter except maybe Snape, but she doesn’t seem to like him very much.

I love that quote n-n <3 you just put a smile on my face for reminding me of it! lol...
It could be snape, I suppose
but I'm thinking that it is probably definitely Minerva and Albus. Because we'd have to have met the character before.

JKR says that she's not introducing new characters, so that eliminates any other wife for albus except for minerva. (I say this because even if albus had a different wife, we probably haven't met her.. so that means that we wont meet her, because she would be a new character... if that makes sense.)

[beMMADfabulous]

Lol, it didn't seem that way to me at all. That's actually a major shipping scene for me.

[alter.ego.alana]

I kind of always had the thought that maybe they called each other "Professor," to be cute. =) Or, maybe, because they were mad at each other. Either way, it's how I justify it to myself.

It's an odd scene. I agree with tabbycat in that maybe JKR just didn't have any plans for a relationship between them at that point.

[beMMADfabulous]

alteregoalana said:

It's an odd scene. I agree with tabbycat in that maybe JKR just didn't have any plans for a relationship between them at that point.

Yeah. I've heard a few times that JK first had in mind that Minerva would be around 30 or 40 something or so, but she later made her older. Hmm.... ;D

& I always figured they hardly ever used first names so they could be more secretive, of course.

[mmadlyinlove]

Yeah, I always thought they would use Professor in a meak attempt to be professional. Saying "Minerva" or "Albus" too much might make them slip up in some way, so therefore they might call each other by their professor title to avoid any accidental slip ups.

"You'll find out why" is like saying "even you, the readers, cannot know they are secretly married." Because this is like saying "Even to let you know is to let too much to get out before I'm ready for it to come out" if that makes any sense. It's such a well kept secret that not even her readers can know.

[revolutionaryetude]

I always thought that it was strange that Minerva McGonagall is the first person from the wizarding world we meet. She starts off the wizarding world in a way. J.K. mentioned in an interview, that the first chapter of The philosopher's stone was very important. Mcgonagall has not been a pivital plot character. (Even though she is my favorite). But why was she there? Why wasn't Remus Lupin there? Or another more pivital character, someone who seemed closer to the Potters? Or was she close to the Potter, she had to feel a sense of something to sit on a wall all day and look at the Dursleys. Also at what time did Voldemort really kill the Potters?Hagrid told her Dumbledore would be at the Dursleys, persumably that morning. So where was Harry, Hagrid, and Dumbledore all day? Hagrid said he pulled him out before the Muggles got there, presumably right after the attack. So what did they do all day? Dumbledore did not seem to care that she was there. It was almost as though he thought that she might have been there. He chuckled when he saw her. He didn't frown or look grim at her presence, but for some reason though it was slightly humerous. I also want to know how Dumbledore knew that Hagrid told Minerva he'd be there? Did she just happen to find Hagrid? Did she live at Hogwarts during the summer, or was she really part of the original Order of the Phoenix? It seemed to me that they had an indepth understanding of each other. I thought it was funny though when he told her about the ear muffs situation and she turned and glared at him. They were certainly familiar with each other with it seems to be with careful sense of decorum. They almost seemed too formal, like it was an act. I had a odd feeling at the end of their dialoge, it was a very strange discussion. Why also has noone told Harry that Minerva Mcgonagall was there.

[pinnacle]

alesia said:

This is actually really funny we are talking about as I JUST reread that chapter like 5 hours ago (I started my reread for DH today). Anyway I always read Albus's remark back to her as a bit flippant like 'duh Minerva we have known each other for 35 years (lovers or not) and you show all of your 3rd years your form of course I know it was you'.

Knowing what we know now you see that he is also a bit cocky in this scene. Albus knows that Voldemort is gone, that he has acted in accordance with the prophecy and marked Harry as his equal, so Albus knows that eventually he has THE weapon needed to use against Voldemort AND that they have a little bit of a break since Voldemort has been 'killed'. To some extant the banter between them is reminiscent of friends who are fighting with each other. Or at least that is my opinion.

I also hold out hope because of JKR’s comments about the married professors.

Have any of the Hogwarts professors had spouses?
JKR: Good question - yes, a few of them, but that information is sort of restricted - you'll find out why..”

www.accio-quote.org/articles/2001/0301-bbc-rednose.htm


What other Professor would it matter except maybe Snape, but she doesn’t seem to like him very much.

I've started my DH reread as well, too. Apparently very few other people are doing it, but then again, not many people have so much extra time as I do. By the way, I definitely agree with you about JKR's quote - really, who else would she be talking about?

revolutionaryetude said:

I always thought that it was strange that Minerva McGonagall is the first person from the wizarding world we meet. She starts off the wizarding world in a way. J.K. mentioned in an interview, that the first chapter of The philosopher's stone was very important.

I also grin whenever I read the first chapter because this is so true. I didn't know that Jo considered the first chapter to be important, though. I always thought it was just a regular introductory chapter. Hmm... this is so exciting, guys!

[beMMADfabulous]

Yes, I've always felt like Albus and Minerva's dialogue at the beginning of PS was very important, even when I read it for the first time (yeah, I was 8, but I was a very perceptive child, lol, and I shipped people back then as well). I didn't know, either, though that JK considered the first chapter to be important. I've always thought Albus seemed to expect Minerva to be there since his first words to her. They instantly seemed to have a connection. I've even considered that sometimes it seems Albus and Minerva seem to liiterally force themselves to stay on a last name basis because they are obviously closer than that.

[beatabeatrix]

everything written so far makes me soo happy

[misshoneychurch88]

What that makes me think of is two of my teachers in high school. They were married, but she always called him Mr. Kent. He called her Donna. It was cute. And this was a couple that everyone knew was married, so I can see if they didn't want people to know they'd use formal titles and such

[revolutionaryetude]

Do you think that Dumbledore's formal acknowledgement of MInerva could have been subtle hint for her to not look too friendly with him. He used the outputter, but why if he was just going to meet Hagrid? Presumably most people (muggles) would have been asleep. He did not know what Hagrid was going to bring Harry in, so I always thought that removing all light was slightly awkward. Wouldn't the Muggles notice that all the lights were out. Could he meeting with Minerva be in itself a secret, there could be someone watching or he felt a presence. Could he be protecting Mcgonagall? Would everyone be able to recognize her as the tabby across the street, or passing by?

[hpimperfections]

beatabeatrix said:

Maybe this has been discussed before, I apologise if it has.
ADMM shipper though I am, their first scene in PS and the only one in which they are alone in all the books, I think, is a problem for me. One would expect them to act in a different way. They don't even seem to be close friends. What are your opinions? Tell me I am wrong

I don't really see how you'd expect them to act. They aren't teenagers anymore, so it's not like they'd be snogging every time they get together or something. I think it goes back to the question (in one of the other threads) about whether or not they're really equals. In the books Dumbledore is much more intelligent than your average wizard, but the movies (which are about 10 times more sexist, by the way ) really, really downplay the intelligence and power of all the other characters besides Harry and Dumbledore, especially when it comes to Minerva and Hermione. I can only conclude that the directors of PS didn't think about the ADMM ship too much when they put in that scene and didn't think that Minerva should be seen as Dumbledore's equal.

[revolutionaryetude]

Is the scene with McGonagall the only scene in which any one that argues with Dumbledore. I only remember Cornelius Fudge openly argue with him, but at that time they were enemies. In the first chapter though, Minerva openly questions Dumbledores decision with Harry. I thought that was strange considering everyone's ability to agree with Dumbledore's decisions all of the time. MInerva certainly didn't treat him like a man who is her superior or her boss.

[notoriousscrat]

Honestly, the thing I always thought was weird about this scene as far as the ship is when he offers her a lemon drop---she asks him what it is. It was his password Harry's second year, so one assumes it would have come up before then. Basically I've always had to assume that she never bothered to find out what he munches on and it just happened to come up then.

[MMADfan]

notoriousscrat said:

Honestly, the thing I always thought was weird about this scene as far as the ship is when he offers her a lemon drop---she asks him what it is. It was his password Harry's second year, so one assumes it would have come up before then. Basically I've always had to assume that she never bothered to find out what he munches on and it just happened to come up then.

I thought it was a sherbet lemon, though I don't have the book with me so I can't look it up. But isn't this scene when Harry's a baby? I'm confused . . . Harry's second year was something like 11 years after the door-step delivery. But, as I say, I'm confused and may not be talking about the same scene. However, if it is the scene I'm thinking of, and it is 11 years before Harry's second year, I don't see any problem with it. He could very well have only discovered the existence of sherbet lemons -- or just discovered their tastiness ;D (don't ya love that fizzle on the tongue?) -- and therefore no matter how well Minerva knew him, they could be his "new favorite" sweet. He does seem to like them, after all . . . could be he was always after offering her one sweet or another . . . . But then, as I said, I'm confused.

[notoriousscrat]

Yeah, I was referring to that bit in CoS. That was back before they stopped translating the books into American, so it says lemon drop in there. Sorry about the confusion. ;D

I suppose that could just have been a new-found favorite, honestly the thought had never occurred to me. I'd always gotten the impression that he'd liked them for at least a little while, given how he explained them to her. "A muggle sweet I'm rather fond of" as opposed to "a muggle sweet I just discovered."

Maybe I'm just reading into it a bit too much.