OMG! FInal Chapter Spoilers.

[Herzele]

I so hope JK Rowling hurries up with the last book to answer all the questions and clear the confusion ...

[palanfanaiel]

I'm still in this very distraught stupor of denial...

I kinda knew he was going to die, and the whole black hand thing only made my suspicions worse, but when it actually happens, I cried so hard... I mean, couldn't she at least have waited till book 7!!!

I don't think the school willl be closed, I mean, for me that would kinda ruin something of the books, since they're centered around hogwarts and the whole school scenario... But I could see lots of students not returning to school, because of their parents and families. But I would think that kinda stupid, even though its war you can't stop living, and thinking positive, wouldn't it be nice to have completed school, and have a life and job after Voldemorts gone...

I with you guys about Minerva's reactions, you would have thought they would be more dramatic, but still, there's the almost fainting and steeling herself.... Poor Min... I would have liked to see a bit more with her in the books, but well it is Harry it's about.

I liked that you got a lot of questions answered in this book, that was nice, though I love when a book leaves you with thousands of questions... Well, it kind of did too =) Can't wait for book 7...

But hey, we didn't get the whole staff-spouse-question answered???

As much as I cheered finding out Fudge had been sacked, I'm not that happy about the current one either?

Well that was just my thoughts for the moment, still too sad to dwell too much on it all...

Pal

[foci]

Read the death scene again. Jaya, I'm with you on this one. Although I couldn't sleep more than 4 hours. *I* felt bad at trusting Snape.

[Taylor]

Well,
I have read the book again with precious little sleep in me and I have a few things to say.

Dumbledore knew he was dieing. he knew the cost of drinking the potion, and removing the soul from the ring killed a part of him. (remember that he said when you kill something a part of your soul was torn?)

Snape didn't have a choice in killing Dumbledore. The vow made him do it. The vow made him protect Draco at all costs, and it made him finish what he couldn't do. I think Dumbledore knew this.

Is Dumbledore dead? Yes, sorry. Will some part of him come back?

yes. Remember the portrates? all of the past headmasters to give wisdom and assistance to the current headmaster/ headmistress- so there will be a portrate of Albus in his office and life will go on.

I don't think the school will close- because JK said that one of the students will stay behind to teach. but not ron/ hermioney or harry.

Yes, JK made a lot of shippers happy. There seems to be many portrats who speak, but why weren't any made of Harrys parents?

I think I understand what Minerva is feeling right now- sometimes when the most horrible things happen, you can't fall apart, you have to be strong, and brave.

the reaction of Fluer to Bill being hurt, while she is a bit vane, - but I knew, something was going to galvenize the relationship between Molly and she. The two women won't agree on alot of things, but they will aways agree on the love for Bill. Besides, he is gringots curse breaker! what better person to work on something to get well?

He was their friend, and he betrayed them.

that line was in POA movie, one that i knew was going to be a watch word.

Draco doesn't have it in him to kill. Snape on the other hand does.

And before anyone panics about not being able to write snogs or lemons or other fics, we still have 150 yrs of Albus's life, half of which he has been with Minerva. The majority of the fictions don't have ANYTHING to do with Harry, so, not to worry- there is aways time in our hearts to write memories.

Though, I am disapointed that we didn't get some answers that we really wanted-

Albus at least gave Harry someone to discuss what is going on -Ron, and Hermione.
And it was very sad that Percy being the git that he is, made christmas so horrid.

Perhaps, the school may close except for the students that belong to DA. or those who wish to fight Voldemort.

Why worry about He who must not be named or You know who? Worry about YOU KNOW POO...

Hermione has liked Ron for ages.

ah well.
Some ships are ment to sail into the sunset, and others into the night.

Taylor

[foci]

Jaya, rogueinker – you saved my life. I’ll be out of town in 2 days, hell, out of the country, and there is no way that I can take HBP with me on a hiking trip. So I have 2 days and a couple of hours to find satisfactory answers to all my nagging questions. Not a nice situation, not at all. Plus, I have to pack.

First of all, thanks for clearing up the Snape part for me. I always try to see things from a book1-book6 perspective and Snape being evil just doesn’t make any sense!
I wholeheartedly agree with the theory that Albus and Snape expected this task, and that Snape knew what he agreed to do when he cast that spell.

Things don’t make sense otherwise. Why was his hand twitching when casting the Unbreakable Vow? Why did he warn Draco not to get expelled? (then he would have had to kill Albus - sooner) The longer it took Draco to come up with a plan, the more time Albus had to explain Harry the Horcruxes.

And the conversation between Albus and Snape… What if Snape wanted to show his loyalty to Dumbledore (hence his “I don’t want to continue to…”)? Did Albus ask him then to proceed and kill him if necessary? It’s very likely.

This would also explain the hatred in Snape’s face when he casts the spell – it must be hatred towards Voldemort.

Snape’s allegiances are crucial to the book – they have been since PS. JKR kept us on our toes, made us believe that he was a bad guy. I know that a lot of people never thought him good, I was convinced though since GOF that he was on the Light Side. (and I read the first three books in 3 weeks before reading GOF, so it didn’t take me long to make up my mind)

OOTP strengthened this belief. JKR probably wanted us to question Harry’s judgement (or at least realised that adults would question it) and now she did the unthinkable – and she wants us (all of us) to think that Snape’s bad. I’m not buying into this just yet. It is a brilliant move – I always thought that she came up with a plot, that when we reach the end of book 7 would force us to read all the books again – and Snape turning out to be good after all (and acting on Albus’ orders all the way in HBP) would have this effect on most people.

As Rikki said – there has to be a moral to the story. In HBP, the similarities between Snape and Voldie were very much emphasised. But there is one crucial difference: we can’t know for sure whether Snape can love. We still don’t know how he felt about Lily. Yep, he called her a mudblood in that memory – but never, in Harry’s six year at Hogwarts, he never insulted or mentioned Lily. That fact itself speaks volumes.

Okay, so I seem to think that there was a plan after all, a plan between Albus and Snape. A plan that – sadly enough, worked, and turned Snape into Voldie’s most trusted DE. A plan that suggests that Snape will die in book 7 (not that we didn’t suspect this earlier).

Logically thinking (in Albus’ place), this suggests, that he thought that Harry had all the information he needed to find the Horcruxes – or did he make arrangements for the Order members to help Harry? Was there another plan? Or was he just hoping that Minerva and co would be loyal and helpful? Either way, it looks like Harry will need help to destroy the rest of the Horcruxes (I counted – still 4 or 5 to go, depending on whether Regulus destroyed the one he promised to destroy).

One of the Horcruxes is Voldemort himself. So…all this means that Albus hoped that the rest of the Order can help Harry finding and destroying the Horcruxes and he needed Snape to be on the DEs side to help Harry finish off Voldie in the end… Albus said in the book that you would need very advanced spells to kill Voldie and Harry ain’t at that level yet.

I’m still doubtful about Hogwarts reopening – I can imagine it, with fewer students, very advanced training for Harry and co and making weekend trips to find the Horcruxes…okay, looks like I’m not quite there yet.

What I fail to understand is… how are we supposed to learn the remaining secrets??? Nobody seems to know why Albus trusted Snape. (Well, we all have our ideas, I still hold on to my he loved Lily theory but how is Harry supposed to find out that? If Snape helps him kill Voldie and gets himself killed in the process, he can’t explain things, can he?). What will Harry learn in Godric’s Hollow?

Tonks is the only one how could provide information about Regulus to the Light Side.

And if it took many trips for Albus to collect information about the Horcruxes, what is Harry supposed to do? One is Voldie, one is Nagini, one was moved by Regulus and we haven’t seen the locket or the Slytherin stuff (either of them could have been in that “Pensieve”).

Was there another plan for the school, for Harry, for the staff for his seventh year?

Thank God, things seem a bit clearer to me. And I’m sorry about my rambling, but your opinions help me form my own… and as I said, I have 2 days to tone down my reaction to a level that the rest of the humanity can tolerate – which proves to be a hard task.

PS: Snape doesn’t really answer Bellatrix’s question about why he stayed at Hogwarts – he said he was useful as a spy after teaching there for 15 years (which I thought Albus would suggest him to say if asked) – but this is not a real answer. How did he know that Voldie would return? How did he know that he would be a useful spy? Bella doesn’t notice this slip.

[foci]

Also, now I see why Harry has to destroy the Horcruxes first. Thanks for clearing up that as well!

What I've been wondering about is... if Snape had turned traitor, what would have Albus said to him before he cast Avada Kedavra. Probably the same three words.

[Alesia]

I still have some open issues with book 6. I can accept Albus is dead, I guess. Everyone dies and he believed death was the next step for an organized mind (which when you look at it is interesting foreshadowing) but why would she not answer the question about married Hogwarts staff in this book??

I mean we all know, plot wise it doesn't matter if any of the rest of the staff is married - it only matters if it is either Minerva, Albus or Snape. I need to go back to the quick quills website and look but I thought in one of her chats she said no one loves Snape and Snape didn't love anyone (in a romantic sense). So why when she killed Albus didn't see reveal that Min and he were a couple, what more could it matter? Or is there a conversation between Minerva and Harry coming about him not giving up on life and breaking it off with Ginny?

Snape - good or bad? I don't know. Again I go back to what JK has said in interviews and such. She doesn't like Snape, (as a person but loves him as a character) which makes me think he is bad, BUT choice is a huge part of the series so maybe he was good but again chose to return to the Dark side? Or will he chose to return to the Light by dying for Harry in the end?

I have to agree with someone would said that this book sends a very bad message - trust no one who was once bad. That there is no true change of heart. (It kind of reminds me of "Empire Strikes Back" - you walked out and were really upset because the bad guys had won the round).

I want to see what her responses are to the chat she had yesterday. It should be interesting.

Oh, one other thing did she just blow her own timeline or is it my imagination? Riddle started at Hogwarts in 1938. Albus, it was previously thought, did start teaching until the early 40s. This means he started earlier (and I didn't get the impression he was a first year teacher when he went to see Tom) then we thought and he taught Minerva longer then we thought. I can't find the canon reference to him starting to teach in the 40s. Any body know where that is? The Lexicon doesn't have the link.

More later as my brain processes it.


bonnie

[Nerweniel]

I suppose it's time for my two cents, too .

I cried so hard when I read the end of HBP, my parents thought I'd gone mad, but now I've thought about it, I just don't think Albus's death was... you know, worth it. If JKR would kill Albus of, I'd always thought it'd be during the final fight, and at least by Voldemort himself- not by Snape. Plus, is it just me or did Albus behave... unusual during the entire book?

I don't know, but I think there is a chance that Albus staged his own death, helped by Snape. I can't believe Snape really killed him, and not because I like Snape, but because I think it just doesn't fit for him to turn evil now. I mean first JKR makes him all suspicious, and then slowly she starts to redeem him in our eyes... just to make him turn out to be evil? I don't know about that one. I just know that if Voldemort believed Albus was dead, Albus would have a lot more freedom to operate and help Harry.

All in all, I think it was a pretty strange book. It had its good parts, but I still like OotP better .

Love,

Lies

PS: And of course AD/MM just rocks on. I personally think that Minerva saying "It was all my fault!" was, though not true, very shippy .

[angeldust]

humm maybe we should kidnap JK and make her write the last few chapters in the ad/mmest way possible!

[rogueinker]

Ok, Foci, I’m going to play Devil’s Advocate and echo everyone’s theories on choices made and unmade. Here are two scenarios playing in my head.

Bad Snape / Fallible Albus - Albus now knows that Snape has been a fence sitter for a long time. HIs white faced expression when Harry told him what Trelawney said about seeing Snape at the Hogs Head that night is suspicious. By having Snape do it, Albus was pushing him off the fence thus making his allegiance crystal clear. What else could Albus have done? In my head the mental conversation went:

Albus: No more hiding in the shadows waiting for the final winner, Severus.
Severus: I .... I don’t ...
Albus: You’ve played the game superbly.
Severus: I follow orders, yours ... his. Does it matter?
Albus: You could have made it matter.
Severus: I never had a choice.
Albus: Cowards never win their freedom on their own.
Snape hesitates.
Albus: I choose your hand over another.
Albus: “Severus, please.”
Snape does the deed.


Good Snape / Wise Albus - Perhaps, Albus learned from his mistakes with Tom and when Snape was in school, Albus watched him more closely. I was surprised by Albus’ insistence in revealing what he knew about Tom to Harry. Was it to contrast with someone else later on? I think it was Albus who made sure that Harry got the HBP Potions text. I think that Snape’s move to DADA was supposed to make his position with the DE stronger. Plus, this is the first time that we see Albus go to extravagant lengths to get a new teacher, Slughorn. Albus had a plan to retrieve all the horcruxes when all the pieces of his pet theory were fitting into place. Everything he seems to have done or said in HBP point to that. I think that Albus was fed up with trying to work from the inside i.e. via the Ministry and decided in OotP that he HAD to take a more active role. Instead of waiting year in and year out for Voldemort to try to kill Harry. OotP struck me as the prep phase for him.

Contrast Tom’s student days with Severus. One was devious and hid his activities, the other seemed to be more open and victimized by the marauders with some regularity. Tom had his inner circle. No evidence that Snape was the leader of anything. Both were brilliant but only one was malicious from the start i.e. the confession in the orphanage. Perhaps, Snape was shunned by the Slytherins because he was not a pureblood. We know nothing (yet) about Eileen Prince and Tobias Snape. Perhaps the “this book belongs to the half blood prince” was more self-deprecatory than we realize. Snape would have had to have been obsessed with potions and not world domination to have done all that extra work in his potions book.

I find it hard to swallow that Snape is all bad given how he tried to shield the kids from the Lupin/Werewolf in PoA, the anti-jinxing of Harry’s broom and so forth. It’s one thing to look good for the man you’re supposed to be spying for and another to do the little, humane things like defending dunderheads against mortal peril. Snape just doesn’t have the monomaniacal ego that Voldemort seems to possess.

But well laid plans never go as planned. I don’t think Dumbledore thought he would be as weak as he was when they came back. If Harry hadn’t touched the water to fill the goblet, would the Fenris have known they were there, leading Albus to save them and weaken himself more? Colossal mistake bringing Harry with him to the cave, in my opinion.

When Draco burst in, Albus was chatting, playing for time, trying to turn the situation his way. He had to have been surprised when Fenrir and Amycus came in hence his insistence in knowing HOW they got in. He kept them talking so Harry would get the information. When Snape burst in, the die was cast. By that point there was only one way for things to resolve so that Dumbledore’s plan would not fall apart completely. Mental conversation:

Severus: Two against three. We can -
Albus: Too late. Too weak now.
Severus: What do you need?
Albus: Must buy time for you and the boy.
Severus: How?
Albus: Kill me. Run. Do not return.
Severus: There must be another way.
Albus: One last favor of you.
Snape hesitates.
Albus: Severus, please.
Revolted by what he must do but knowing there is no other way, he does it.

Reason for Albus’ Death (seeming or otherwise) - I think JKR was in a corner. I think there had to be a final prod for Harry to take his destiny seriously. He had to become selfless - to kill Voldemort less because of the prophecy or saving his own skin but more for a really good heroic reason. Now, Harry has the reason(s) - carry out Dumbledore’s last orders, go on a quest and save the world from senseless evil. He’s going to do it not because he is supposed to but because he wants to. Since the series is Harry centric that makes sense. Do I agree that Albus had to be the one to go - NO.

Is there now a reason for Harry’s resolve to stay firm? Yes, it goes by the name of Snape. If you think about it, JKR has always used Snape to sway Harry’s emotions/outlook one way or the other. Voldemort wasn’t around to be the daily bad guy so Snape was it.

Snape the Human Being - I like to think that he will emerge more good than bad, perhaps a victim of his own choices yet with some honor and dignity. The scene with Narcissa seemed so off because it showed Snape caring about someone else besides himself. So, he does have honor somewhere. I think JKR’s use of non-Harry POV while jarring is quite telling. I hope she will open up Book 7 even more. I just can’t see her NOT explaining more about Snape and Dumbledore. Why did Dumbledore trust him so much for so long?

Timeline - Alesia, I’m with you on that one. Seems fishy.

HBP - Some stuff seems so forced to me. I get a feeling that JKR wanted to cut off some fanfic avenues with this book hence the ship references.

[nicole]

what about ginny? i cant belive he broke it off.. i dont think it will last long though. whatcha think? do you think they will get 2gether and search 4 the horcruxes? im so glad he is happier in this book. the 5th annoyed me b/c he was stormin and screamin all tha time.
i cried soo hard when dumbly died

[bee.]

oh gosh. of all the people JK could have killed off instead. i think everyone had a gut feeling it was a huge posibility albus would die in the end, but of course no one wants to believe it. i kept hoping the huge character that would died would be aragog instead of albus, which was totally pointless, but at least i could ignore my instincts for a couple more chapters.
I've also decided I really don't like draco and snape. i completely understand snape and dumbledore may have had an agreement, but I still feel like pointing fingers.
anyway, im really hoping there's still something to look forward to in book 7. surely albus can't come back from the dead, but there are other ways for his spirit to exist, like through portraits... i was looking around mugglenet moping and looking at articles that have recently been posted. heres what i've found.

She [JK] said that, more than ever before, the end of the sixth book will leave big clues as to what's to come in book seven.

as well as...

"There is plenty to guess at... at least one thing I think people will probably deduce, there is a mystery left at the end, but I think they might already know the answer if they think about it."

and...

Of course, there were questions the author refused to answer because they would give too much of the final plot away. She didn't answer how she thought up the special bond between Harry and Voldemort, or how much of a part Fawkes plays in book seven.

perhaps Fawkes will have a role connecting to albus?
anyway... until i get my answers, im quite happy thinking up impossible ways albus still exists... and im also quite happy reading lovely mmad fanfiction.
hoorah for ignorance.
ecks oh ecks oh ecks oh,
bee

[Alesia]

(Sorry I know I am combining threads here but it all kind of exploded so I put it on the main thread)

The only way I can see us getting a lot of Minerva in book 7 is if she is the next OoP head and headmistress. It looks like book 7 is going to pick up where 6 left off without much interruption so the school may stay closed until Christmas or something. And unfortunately the more I think about it - I think she killed Albus for good. I am going to be beyond pissed if JK decides ADMM weren't a ship. That is the way she has always written them - as a couple (just like Ron and Hermione). I also feel like she didn't give us all of the information she promised with this book. It was supposed to give us more answers then questions. All I really got as far as answers was that Voldy was a psycho (from childhood) who is afraid death and has done everything in his power to not be able to die - BFD we all already knew that, didn't we?

It bothers me she flubbed her own timeline too, unless we are off as to when Riddle left Hogwarts. Did he leave after his OWLS rather then his NEWTS? Uh hadn't thought of that. To go help Grindelwald maybe? Like Draco was talking about not coming back next year as well?

It seems perfectly logical to me Draco would become a DE at 16 since Snape started teaching at Hogwarts when he was 20 or 21 and had been a DE for a while - hence he became a DE either while at Hogwarts or right after why is it such a stretch for anyone to think Draco, who is predisposed to be a DE because of his father, wouldn't be one now? Do you think she was trying to make it seem to everyone (especially Ron and Hermione at the beginning) that Harry was crying wolf about both Draco and Snape as usual?

I know I am all over the place with this but am still trying to reconcile what is in HBP with what we know about books 1 through 5. I am having trouble doing that.

bonnie

[Sensiblyquirky]

Whew I read everyone's comments in one fell go.

On Snape I have not passed judgement, which is rare, since I do not like him. I find both the dark Snape and the good Snape plausible. If the latter it shows to the infinite degree what kind of man Dumbledore was. Willing to die for Harry, Snape, and Draco. His death actually saved all three. I hate his dying, and am depressed but I see why she did it.

For me it was the final step to push Harry down the path that was chosen for him. The last of his protectorates has died, and now it is just Harry and his friends. No one of greater knowledge to always impart or get him out of trouble. This book was preparing harry, and I think, to my woe, that Dumbledore's death was part of his preparation. He has more insight than ever, fully understands why love is his greatest strength, and now has no one but himself and his friends (who are on equal status with him) to rely.

As to possible ooc characteristics in Minerva. I think it important to note that no matter how composed that moment we saw her it would be a 'surreal' one for her. Her emotions are struggling, she's grapling with her duties, the reality, and I think no matter how composed we would all act differently than 'normal.' I agree her looking at his portrait was a big thing...made me so sad.

I'm stuck more on what happens with her and 3/4 of the characters in the next book. Harry's path no longer dictates him toward the school, but if he and ron and hermione go off what happens? Does JKR just leave a huge part of her characters hanging? No development, no anything. Most is from Harry's pov, and whenever we meet Harry in the books...two or five chapters in we never leave his pov from then on. So if they go off we shouldn't get snipets of other tales...too lord of the rings. Though communication would be possible for a bit, not for all of their journey.

Overall Dumbledore's death put a damper on the whole book for me. I also thought she rushed through some things, and was disappointed with the lack of or stalled development in many characters...namely my favorite: McGonagall.

As she said now I just have more questions, with some added info. Sigh.

Christy

[foci]

Rogueinker, I owe you one!

I have all my answers, thank to you. Snape is good - at least in my eyes - I have found the final piece to the jigsaw puzzle.

"Kill me like you killed him, you coward - "

"DON'T - " screamed Snape, and his face was suddenly demented, inhuman as though he was in as much pain as the yelping, howling dog stuck in the burning house behind them, "- CALL ME COWARD!" Adult version page 564.

Unless Snape killed Albus on Albus' orders, this doesn't make sense. I think that we see the real Snape for the first time in HBP - unmasked, in inhuman pain, just moments after he had to do the most painful thing ever, killing the last person on earth he wanted to kill.

Snape doesn't look guilty, he isn't outraged (which bad Snape would be) - he is demented, he is in pain. Harry calls him coward just after he did the deed that would ensure that he - Snape - would be able to help him, Harry, in the final battle, and in order for this, he had to kill the person he valued the most.

For me, this seals it all. I also reread every other relevant part about him in HBP, and there is no hole, no gap. It makes sense that nobody knows what really happened... If only one person (say Minerva) knew, Snape would be in mortal danger as a DE.

All of this of course means, that Albus is dead. This doesn't make me happy, but he was dead 24 hours ago when I thought Snape was a coward, and now he is still dead but turns out that Snape did the hardest thing in his life (even harder than offering his services to Albus in 1981) and books 1-6 make all sense. Considering that I was preparing for Albus' death for weeks but I always believed that Snape was good, I assume I would sleep longer tonight than 4 hours.

Alesia, the timeline isn't messed up - at least I haven't noticed yet. In Cos, it turns out that 1943 was Riddle's final year. What does contradict this in HBP?

However, I have noticed a huge mistake - first years at Quidditch try-outs??? Honestly, PS was all about Harry being the only first year in 100 years to make the team.

[Herzele]

I was wondering about that, too ... Did they suddenly change the rules for everyone ? Another thing JK Rowling doesn't tell us ...

[Mellypoo622]

I just finished, like literally just closed the book. I knew what was comming from the begining and was just dreading getting to the end. I kept finding reasons not to continue reading. But, I finally did it. I made myself read it and I cried so much! I have NEVER cried that much at a book, movie, tv show, fic, or anything else ..well for lack of a better word... fictional. Besides the end of that chapter when it actually happened, I have to say the part I cried the most at was when Harry was talking to the minister! I was so happy at the loyalty he showed to Dumbledore.

I really hope that there's something crazy going on and this whole death thing was a lie but I don't know....

I'm still deciding how I feel about this book... I don't know if I liked it as much or not... hmm i dunno....

and the ships.... I'm not very happy with R/Hr. I really am just not a ron fan at all! But H/G I guess I can live with, I would much much much rather H/Hr though.


*sigh* I'm going to ponder the events of this book more..

[Krystal]

I hope all you RedeemableSnape believers are correct but I think Albus was a bit more aware of Snape and wanted to believe that he would choose good in the end. After all he gave chance after chance and I think the book shows that some return to the dark (Snape) while others choose not to (Draco). I also think that Severus claiming not to be a coward is tantamount to something Snivelus probably hated as a child by certain Gryffindors.

One more point that bothers me is when Albus told Harry to pay attention to what Tom was like. He was a loner, apparently friendless, and after glory. Snape wanted that Order of Merlin's medal so badly he could taste it and how delusional is calling yourself the half blood prince? That is Snape through and through. I think we see a lot of his character there. Also after what happened in OOTP, even Albus admitted Snape couldn't overcome his hatred of James (including Harry) and there is no way in hell Snape can help Harry defeat Voldemort if Harry doesn't trust him.

[TabbyForever]

OK right now i am having a lot of trouble not crying at the though of our couple being so horribly torn apart!!
I would also like a bounty on JKR for her sheer narcissicitic approach to our ship!
I think i'm currently in a state of shock and denial... too the point where i can't actually look at even the fluffiest of fluff fics and am probably going to cry my self to sleep tonight!! God what will the neigbours thinks, i've been at it since about 10 o'clock this evening!!

My thoughts on the plot:

Snape MUST DIE for what he's done....JKR has made it plain and clear where his allegience lies!

Min was underused and mistreated!! JKR MUST be punished

Harry seemed to grow up very quickly from book 5, a bit too quick in someways kinda like a sudden change of heart (today i am mostly going to be a good boy and not scream and shout at everything and every one!)

Umbridge...WTF??!! need i say more?

I could go on for hours....I think the main consensus is I don't think i'll be able to pick this book up again and now i'm not even sure if i'll be able to look at the next one!

I would say happy reading...but its not so i won't bother. I would say, forget she ever did this and carry on writing as normal, as i'm sure many of you have alreay decided to do!!
So...Happy writing, may your work be fluffy and romantic.

Jem.xx
Deputy Headmistress

[amandahleigh]

Am going out on a limb here... Albus never really specified what he was pleading for... He only said "Severus..." and "Severus, please...". Perhaps he was pleading with Snape to follow through with their plan and kill him...

My aunt said that too. Maybe that was the plan all along, hence why Dumbledore only wanted to see Severus upon their return to the castle.

Personally, I'd rather believe that than believe that Snape... *shudders*

I mean, we really don't know why Dumbledore trusted Snape so much. I know what Harry thinks, but...somehow, I don't think that's it. Maybe in HP7 Harry speaks to Snape and finds out... Maybe?

[amandahleigh]

Hey, y'all missed another ship supported in HBP!


Madam Pince/Argus Filch!


mmm, everyone loves a good Filch/Pince romance!

AL

[Mellypoo622]

Okay I'm back. I've figured out why I couldn't decide about the book. It didn't seem real. Here's my theory.

We read all of these fics everyday and someone dies, someone turns bad, and such and then it's done and you move onto the next fic where everythings different. But, when I read the book, Albus died and I was like "Okay that was sad but I'd rather it happen another way." But I realize that wow that's the actual sixth book. There is not another version where he doesn't die, that's just how it is.


Did anyone else feel like this? Like it took a long time for the fact that JKR actually killed Dumbledore to sink it?

[Alesia]

Foci et all,

I checked the Lexicon. Riddle was in his 5th year when the Chamber was opened (1943) so either he graduated in 1945 or left Hogwarts after his 5th year.

My issue was that I thought the timeline said Albus started teaching at Hogwarts in the 1940s, in actuality it just says he is teaching at Hogwarts, so he could indeed have been at Hogwarts for sometime when Riddle started in 1938. (it is just a change in my thinking, I had it in my head he started in the early 1940s).

So the issue is with my memory not the timeline. Now if I could just forget the last 2 chapters of HBP, I would be fine, right??

bonnie

[mugglemin]

Oh man...that was a lot to traul through...but it's made me think!

What if Dumbledore was asking Harry to get Snape for him because he knew he was dying and therefore he knew if Snape didn't kill him first, Snape would die (cos Albus knew about the Unbreakable vow). So Albus was trying to save Snape too?

I am not a fan of this idea. In fact, I am writing a "Kill Snape" story. But it did just occour to me.

Sorry if someone else has already mentioned this! There was so much to read from you all, I couldn't take it all in...

And I just wanted to poke my head up on this thread!

AND FINALLY, PLEASE DON'T STOP WRITING FLUFF AND STUFF. I used to be almost die-hard canon...now I ain't!

mugs.x

[foci]

Back to the COWARD stuff. Harry calls Snape a coward twice. Once in reference to the Marauders. Snape doesn't react. The second time around, when there is a reference to Albus, he is suddenly demented and in inhuman pain.

And there is a difference about Snape and Riddle. Riddle can't love. We all know that. All we know about Snape is, however, that he hated James and called Lily a Mudblood once.

I'm going to bashed so much for this, because we're still mourning over Albus' death, but I'm going to publish my Snape loved Lily theory after all.

I think Snape can love and he had a soft spot for Lily in school and he was horrified when she was killed in 1981. In Harry's six years at Hogwarts, he never mentions Lily, never speaks ill of Lily - even though he has plenty of opportunity! He bashes James all the time, yet, Lily ain't mentioned. Then we get a clue that Lily was good at Potions in OOTP, then confirmation in HBP.

So what about that memory? What happened there? James and co humiliated Snape, Lily came to rescue and Snape called her a mudblood. Why is THIS Snape's WORST memory? He was almost killed by Lupin, he killed plenty of people as a DE (we suppose) he probably lost friends, relatives in the war. Yet, his worst memory is showing off his underwear at Hogwarts. Yeah, right.

Think about YOUR worst memory. The very worst thing that you can recall, that would qualify as the WORST memory if you died a second later. I asked a lot of people about this (age between 10-82) and everyone's reply was different, with one exception: it was something THEY DID, not something DONE to them. (It's only logical, you cannot change what was done to you, but you could have acted differently when you did something wrong.)

The only thing that Snape does and stands out is calling Lily a mudblood. (I don't think he regretted to hex Sirius or James.) Why is calling Lily a mudblood his worst memory? Because he liked/loved whatever you prefer her.

So Harry is dead wrong about Snape, he can love. (JKR never denied this. She was revolted at the idea that someone loved SNAPE, but never said anything about the opposite. In fact, when asked whether Snape had a crush on Lily, her answer was: "You speculate?" and then she changed the topic - very interesting.)

That's why Albus trusted Snape and that's why he couldn't tell Harry. Harry hated Snape from day one on, he wouldn't understand and it's not time for Snape to show his loyalties yet.

You may ask: why is Snape so hateful towards Harry if he loved Lily? Answer:
a, Harry is the spitting image of James. I wouldn't like much a mini-James either, if I were him.
b, (suppose he is good) if he is kind to Harry, Draco owls Lucius and his double-spy story is blown. He had to be very public about HATING Harry. Nobody knew what he and Albus discussed in private, but his behavious towards Harry was always out in the open. And - considering Harry's maturity, if Snape told him in private: "look Harry, I like you cause you're Lily's son, but I'll be a bat when someone is around" - can you tell a thing like that to an 11-year old boy?

Alesia, thanks for the timeline reply. I won't have the time to check my books before I leave but I'll get back to this in August.

[Taylor]

Something isn't right. and it took me until almost five in the morning to figure out what it was. JK made a big fluff about the discription of the half blood prince- hang on... Didn't she make a big deal about anouncing the discription of the half blood prince about looking like a lion but that ended up being the discription of the new minister of magic- not the half blood prince. I looked on the lexicon for that discription, but couldn't find it- I know they have been working like house elves with it.

the opening chapter thing, - well, the thing she was going on about was that the MOM kept visiting the muggle minister- we knew that already. Its on her website that she had the worst case of writers block ever with the HBP. Is it any wonder why she settled all the shippers questions and forgot to put in the stuff that she said she was or changed how it ended in a fit of pique?

Harumph!

Taylor.

[foci]

Taylor,
JKR never said it was the description of the prince. That's what most people assumed. It turned out to be the mom.

And her writer's block was with COS, as far as I remember. However, HBP is and remains fanficcish.

[Herzele]

Btw, now that you mention COS - has anyone found the connection ?? Rowling made such a big announcement about a connection between the two books ...

[Nerweniel]

I guess it was the Riddle-thing... you know, that we found out more about his Hogwarts time and such. But it was lame. Then again I guess 'lame" is the no 1 HBP word ;D.

Love,

Lies

[TabbyForever]

I think the connection with CoS is that there is alot of Riddle history in it. Well thats the connection that struck me when i was reading it yesterday, I might be totally wrong, but there was alot of talk about the diary as well as a lot of talk about the young Riddle at school, which in theory could have gone in the second book, but would have been too advanced at that point.
Hope this helps somewhat.

J. xx